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  #1  
Old 01-14-2009, 07:05 PM
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Phreezer Phreezer is offline
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Default Guys that want to gain 25+lbs per cycle.

Here’s some info for guys who want to gain 20-25lbs on a cycle.


Everyone wants to know how to gain high poundages on a cycle. We’ve all got a “friend” in a gym somewhere that gained 25lbs on his last cycle and we want to do the same. We ask ourselves…What is his secret? Is the juice he’s taking that good? Is it a good diet in conjunction with the test.. is that what is responsible? Well, here’s the answer.. NO, his particular anabolic compound of choice be it Sustanon, Winstrol, Dbol, Tren, etc… isn’t so great that whoever takes one of those compounds will grow.. nor is his diet so “on” that he will gain more than us.

Here’s the truth.. and some of you won’t like it.. Some of you may even get pissed off.. The reason these guys grow so much on their cycles is because they shouldn’t even be using steroids to begin with… And that’s the truth… That may sound a bit confusing.. yes? Well allow me to elaborate…

You take a 20 yr old male. He has been lifting on and off for six months or so… He’s about 6 foot tall maybe a little shorter.. 5’10” or so.. He weighs about 165lbs.. He’s got a little bit of definition.. nothing big.. when his shirt is off people can tell he’s been working out.. He decides one day that he wants to take steroids, He sees the really big guys in the gym and he wants to be like them right now.. he doesn’t want to wait any longer.. in his mind six months has been long enough.. So he gets on the internet.. he finds a message board similar to this one.. he reads a little .. finds a hook up.. and decides to run 250mg of test and 300mg of deca for two months and ends up weighing around 185 or 190.. All of his friends are amazed.. he’s amazed He’s put on some size.. he looks like a weight lifter.. he doesn’t look like someone who could compete.. but he looks like he’s finally arrived on the Body building scene… His closest friends are so impressed that they want to run the exact same cycle .. He tells them exactly what he did.. how he ate etc… Now, a few months go by.. all of a sudden the kid is back to around 165 maybe 170.. He thinks.. “Oh man.. I’ve got to get back on cycle.. I need those drugs to be big.. if I don’t.. I just can’t grow… Steroids require that I stay on all the time to maintain the kind of size that I want”… I guess that’s what he has to do; huh; stay on all the time?

Now, here’s the reason he gained 25lbs on his cycle.. He was so far from his genetic potential that once the anabolic compounds were introduced into his system he grew like a weed.. His body didn’t need to struggle to put on that mass, because it was quite capable of adding that much mass naturally.. The steroids just sped it up..

it is for lack of a better or more accurate word.. a short cut to get to where he could have gotten natural anyway. His inevitable weight loss after coming off his "super" cycle wasn’t from the lack of steroids.. it was from a lack of a proper foundation.. a Lack of proper training skills, and a lack of muscular maturation…

Here’s the deal.. guys who need steroids aren’t the guys who are growing 25+lbs per cycle.. they are gaining 10lbs and hopefully keeping 5-8.. They are struggling to even do that.. I’ll tell you from personal experience.. I am 30 yrs old 6’2” .. I am 284lbs currently.. I am 17% BF (I’m a power lifter/strongman.. so I keep a little extra fat on me)…If I wanted to keep the same body fat % I have now and weigh 300lbs.. I would have to run a very long cycle. or in all honesty it will take me two full cycles to get to 3 bills..

An average cycle for me is about 750mg Test, 450mg Deca, 300mg EQ and Some Dbol in the front and at the end… Those are some fairly heavy dosages...Why don’t I gain 25lbs per cycle?

Because No matter how much gear I take.. no matter how much I eat.. my body is so far beyond it’s genetic potential that I simply can’t add that kind of radical mass anymore..

My body does a fairly good job of maintaining mass when I’m not on cycle.. but I do drop weight regardless.. and in truth, the only reason my body maintains it’s size as well as it does is because of Muscle maturation.. My body is used to carrying around that muscle.. it’s not a shock to my body to carry it around.. And I built a solid mass foundation naturally years ago.. I reached my genetic potential before I started using juice.. Lifting was a habit and a lifestyle for me because I played football from Junior high through College.

I’ve worked out in gyms all over the country.. and I have been doing so for the better part of a decade.. and I'll tell you, I have seen a lot of little guys blow up for a couple of months from a cycle only to deflate a couple of months later. It's the truth.. Muscle Maturation plays a huge key in keeping mass... that and proper training skills.. (and no hitting bench 3 days a week and squatting once every few months doesn't count)

So in truth, when you hear about some guy who gained 25-30lbs off of a cycle.. Please keep in mind that he is probably some impatient tiny punk that could have easily gained the same amount of muscle had he just been a little more patient.. If he had just been focused on learning how to train.. focused on how to eat…

This is a lifestyle.. there are no short cuts if you want to be the real deal.... There will never be a fly by nighter even win the smallest amateur comp in booney freaking Iowa if he hasn't been serious for years...

It's important that you guys learn that Juice may seem like the best short cut in the beginning... but whenever you add that much mass that quickly from gear.. Your body isn’t going to be ready for it.. it will literally fight you to keep it.. the sudden size and strength will stress the ligaments, tendons, bones and central nervous system and Your body will do everything that it can to shed those rapid muscle gains.. Decent muscle mass is only kept through time and hard work (cough.. cough.. it's a cliché.. but it's still true).. and it's important that your gains aren't so fast that the body can't adjust healthfully to it’s new weight gain..

I've been on the boards for years.. and I'll tell you, 80% of the people on these boards are wannabes and posers.. they are guys who won’t even be working out six months from now.. They are impatient and are looking for the shortcut.. they may even get a few short term results.. but in the long run they will come out behind everyone else (and when I say long run.. i mean less than a year or two)

These kind of guys will never be anything more than a hobbyist.. and in truth...that is probably the case in every other aspect of their lives as well, not just weight lifting..

So in the end my advice is this.. if you are wanting to add some mass. and you’re stuck.. learn a different training method.. change your diet.. and if you’re a good size.. (that’s when everyone who is in the room with you knows you’re a weight lifter.. if you walk in a room, and everyone in there doesn’t know that you lift… you are not ready for steroids) then come and sit down.. and we’ll talk about steroids.. until then… Learn how to train.. learn how to eat.. and spend some time in the gym.. you’ll be so much better off in the end…

Phreezer
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  #2  
Old 01-14-2009, 07:15 PM
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VERY well said!!
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  #3  
Old 01-14-2009, 07:29 PM
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The truth hurts some times. But that is the same thing I have been telling people for years in the gym.
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Old 01-14-2009, 09:06 PM
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Fucking awesome,well thought,well put post. Probably the best I've read on this board yet.I'm 38, I didn't think about juice until this year and I started lifting at 16. The extra I'm putting on from test e is hard fought and may only add up to 10 or 15 lbs. but it isn't so shocking that people "know" i'm on. Phreezer is right, there is alot of groundwork to be laid before you have any business going to the "dark side" If this saves one kid, or man, the frustration of putting it on only to lose it, it is a worthwhile read.
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Old 01-14-2009, 10:23 PM
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great post bro..very true! Respect your style
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  #6  
Old 01-14-2009, 11:02 PM
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To be honest most people I know who went to juice fizzled out pretty fast. Could not hang with the grind.

I am 37 and have been at it since I was 18. Until recently I had not done a cycle in 5 years. I like to train its in my blood.

I could not gain 25lbs from a cycle no matter what I tried.
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  #7  
Old 01-14-2009, 11:30 PM
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Well thought post I would stick it in here!
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Old 01-15-2009, 12:03 AM
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beyond trying to make insane gains off cycles, is the stress it causes to joints and ligaments. i saw a young guy doing leg presses and bouncing his knees at the top. i was that guy ten years ago. i also thought that i could do a a bomb only cycle (but it was goood...old syntex). if i knew then what i know now, i could have put so much more emphasis on my training and diet. at least i'm at the right place.
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  #9  
Old 01-15-2009, 05:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phreezer View Post
Here’s some info for guys who want to gain 20-25lbs on a cycle.


Everyone wants to know how to gain high poundages on a cycle. We’ve all got a “friend” in a gym somewhere that gained 25lbs on his last cycle and we want to do the same. We ask ourselves…What is his secret? Is the juice he’s taking that good? Is it a good diet in conjunction with the test.. is that what is responsible? Well, here’s the answer.. NO, his particular anabolic compound of choice be it Sustanon, Winstrol, Dbol, Tren, etc… isn’t so great that whoever takes one of those compounds will grow.. nor is his diet so “on” that he will gain more than us.

Here’s the truth.. and some of you won’t like it.. Some of you may even get pissed off.. The reason these guys grow so much on their cycles is because they shouldn’t even be using steroids to begin with… And that’s the truth… That may sound a bit confusing.. yes? Well allow me to elaborate…

You take a 20 yr old male. He has been lifting on and off for six months or so… He’s about 6 foot tall maybe a little shorter.. 5’10” or so.. He weighs about 165lbs.. He’s got a little bit of definition.. nothing big.. when his shirt is off people can tell he’s been working out.. He decides one day that he wants to take steroids, He sees the really big guys in the gym and he wants to be like them right now.. he doesn’t want to wait any longer.. in his mind six months has been long enough.. So he gets on the internet.. he finds a message board similar to this one.. he reads a little .. finds a hook up.. and decides to run 250mg of test and 300mg of deca for two months and ends up weighing around 185 or 190.. All of his friends are amazed.. he’s amazed He’s put on some size.. he looks like a weight lifter.. he doesn’t look like someone who could compete.. but he looks like he’s finally arrived on the Body building scene… His closest friends are so impressed that they want to run the exact same cycle .. He tells them exactly what he did.. how he ate etc… Now, a few months go by.. all of a sudden the kid is back to around 165 maybe 170.. He thinks.. “Oh man.. I’ve got to get back on cycle.. I need those drugs to be big.. if I don’t.. I just can’t grow… Steroids require that I stay on all the time to maintain the kind of size that I want”… I guess that’s what he has to do; huh; stay on all the time?

Now, here’s the reason he gained 25lbs on his cycle.. He was so far from his genetic potential that once the anabolic compounds were introduced into his system he grew like a weed.. His body didn’t need to struggle to put on that mass, because it was quite capable of adding that much mass naturally.. The steroids just sped it up..

it is for lack of a better or more accurate word.. a short cut to get to where he could have gotten natural anyway. His inevitable weight loss after coming off his "super" cycle wasn’t from the lack of steroids.. it was from a lack of a proper foundation.. a Lack of proper training skills, and a lack of muscular maturation…

Here’s the deal.. guys who need steroids aren’t the guys who are growing 25+lbs per cycle.. they are gaining 10lbs and hopefully keeping 5-8.. They are struggling to even do that.. I’ll tell you from personal experience.. I am 30 yrs old 6’2” .. I am 284lbs currently.. I am 17% BF (I’m a power lifter/strongman.. so I keep a little extra fat on me)…If I wanted to keep the same body fat % I have now and weigh 300lbs.. I would have to run a very long cycle. or in all honesty it will take me two full cycles to get to 3 bills..

An average cycle for me is about 750mg Test, 450mg Deca, 300mg EQ and Some Dbol in the front and at the end… Those are some fairly heavy dosages...Why don’t I gain 25lbs per cycle?

Because No matter how much gear I take.. no matter how much I eat.. my body is so far beyond it’s genetic potential that I simply can’t add that kind of radical mass anymore..

My body does a fairly good job of maintaining mass when I’m not on cycle.. but I do drop weight regardless.. and in truth, the only reason my body maintains it’s size as well as it does is because of Muscle maturation.. My body is used to carrying around that muscle.. it’s not a shock to my body to carry it around.. And I built a solid mass foundation naturally years ago.. I reached my genetic potential before I started using juice.. Lifting was a habit and a lifestyle for me because I played football from Junior high through College.

I’ve worked out in gyms all over the country.. and I have been doing so for the better part of a decade.. and I'll tell you, I have seen a lot of little guys blow up for a couple of months from a cycle only to deflate a couple of months later. It's the truth.. Muscle Maturation plays a huge key in keeping mass... that and proper training skills.. (and no hitting bench 3 days a week and squatting once every few months doesn't count)

So in truth, when you hear about some guy who gained 25-30lbs off of a cycle.. Please keep in mind that he is probably some impatient tiny punk that could have easily gained the same amount of muscle had he just been a little more patient.. If he had just been focused on learning how to train.. focused on how to eat…

This is a lifestyle.. there are no short cuts if you want to be the real deal.... There will never be a fly by nighter even win the smallest amateur comp in booney freaking Iowa if he hasn't been serious for years...

It's important that you guys learn that Juice may seem like the best short cut in the beginning... but whenever you add that much mass that quickly from gear.. Your body isn’t going to be ready for it.. it will literally fight you to keep it.. the sudden size and strength will stress the ligaments, tendons, bones and central nervous system and Your body will do everything that it can to shed those rapid muscle gains.. Decent muscle mass is only kept through time and hard work (cough.. cough.. it's a cliché.. but it's still true).. and it's important that your gains aren't so fast that the body can't adjust healthfully to it’s new weight gain..

I've been on the boards for years.. and I'll tell you, 80% of the people on these boards are wannabes and posers.. they are guys who won’t even be working out six months from now.. They are impatient and are looking for the shortcut.. they may even get a few short term results.. but in the long run they will come out behind everyone else (and when I say long run.. i mean less than a year or two)

These kind of guys will never be anything more than a hobbyist.. and in truth...that is probably the case in every other aspect of their lives as well, not just weight lifting..

So in the end my advice is this.. if you are wanting to add some mass. and you’re stuck.. learn a different training method.. change your diet.. and if you’re a good size.. (that’s when everyone who is in the room with you knows you’re a weight lifter.. if you walk in a room, and everyone in there doesn’t know that you lift… you are not ready for steroids) then come and sit down.. and we’ll talk about steroids.. until then… Learn how to train.. learn how to eat.. and spend some time in the gym.. you’ll be so much better off in the end…

Phreezer
This is a very good and true desription of what goes on in the day to day life, esp youngsters looking for a quick fix and they think that they only way they can achieve their goals is through the use of AAS. I never even had a desire to use AAS until my doc put me on TRT at the age of 30. I'm uncertain of what exactly caused the severe depletion of my t levels but I suspect my age played a huge factor. After realizing the benefits of TRT I started doing extensive research every time I took a different compound and of course along the way I have asked for advice and yet even today I continue to research and ask questions. I'm now 35 and I have done quite a few cycles and I admit being on TRT and not having to deal with PCT plays a primary role in why I chose to do long cycles. My last cycle was roughly 6 months long and because like you mentioned it is hard to put on mass after you have been cycling for a while and not to mention I'm probably close to my genetic potential. I finally was able to get a good run and I actually gained close to 20 pounds because I used various compounds throughout, of course some of these gains were fat. My sex drive, attitude, sense of well being and muscular development has been postively affected by use of AAS, eating enough calories, getting enuf rest, and of course training. GREAT POST!
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Old 01-15-2009, 01:36 PM
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that was me in the flesh when i was 20.i had to learn the hard way got off for about 3 years,put on some weight now i started back i'm lucky to get 8-12lbs off of 12 weeks . putting on that much strenth when my body wasn't ready for it has fucked up a few of my joints for life i believe.honestly i wish i never would have started sometimes because of how bad i hurt now.
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Old 01-15-2009, 01:54 PM
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Well sure.....but what if I drink the Winny?!?!
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Old 01-15-2009, 03:16 PM
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i've def read something very similar before several years ago....A-R maybe??

should make this a stickey


this is an excellent post
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Old 01-15-2009, 04:03 PM
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My friend in 12th grade was 135 and had never lifted in his life. So he started lifting and juicing at the same time and within about 3-6 months( it was 18 years ago so cant remember the time frame) he went up to a ripped 195!
I went off to college and came back for X-Mas break and he was back to 135
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Old 01-15-2009, 07:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by karlHungus View Post
i've def read something very similar before several years ago....A-R maybe??

should make this a stickey


this is an excellent post
Possibly, Some of my posts and rants have gotten posted on various boards. I wrote this originaly for Meso about three or four years ago.

I am friends with Brian the owner over at Anabolic Review and it wouldn't bother me if he allowed someone to repost it there.
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Old 01-15-2009, 08:04 PM
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I agree that this should definitely be made a "sticky"
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Old 01-15-2009, 10:16 PM
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Another vote for this being a sticky
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Old 01-15-2009, 10:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Franchize View Post
My friend in 12th grade was 135 and had never lifted in his life. So he started lifting and juicing at the same time and within about 3-6 months( it was 18 years ago so cant remember the time frame) he went up to a ripped 195!
I went off to college and came back for X-Mas break and he was back to 135
lol I think that was me.
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Old 01-16-2009, 02:04 PM
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Thanks for this post, I was getting discouraged. Now I realize that a moderate weight gain with a loss of bodyfat is probably for the best.
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  #19  
Old 01-16-2009, 02:15 PM
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i never touched juice till i had 20 years of trainig under my belt
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Old 01-16-2009, 02:18 PM
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outstanding contribution. the quick fix is also quickly undone. patience, food, work, then gear if it's for you
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Old 01-16-2009, 05:19 PM
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another great post from the big man............11
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Old 01-16-2009, 07:01 PM
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adding gains like that is def tough on the ligaments and joints...I've never taken steroids, but the rate at which I gain strength and size has def taken it's toll on my knees and elbows. Good training routines are always a plus. Simply going on a weightlifting website and imitating a workout is never a good idea. Read books about strength training or talk to the experts.
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Old 01-16-2009, 08:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by asu_rugby View Post
adding gains like that is def tough on the ligaments and joints...I've never taken steroids, but the rate at which I gain strength and size has def taken it's toll on my knees and elbows. Good training routines are always a plus. Simply going on a weightlifting website and imitating a workout is never a good idea. Read books about strength training or talk to the experts.
I agree, copying someone els's routine is not the way to go.
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Old 01-16-2009, 10:22 PM
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this is up there with the best threads i have ever read...
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Old 01-16-2009, 10:24 PM
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ya sticky, sticky, sticky...that should almost be a mandatory read.
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