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  #51  
Old 05-22-2008, 02:49 PM
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Originally Posted by tank23 View Post
HOW LONG CAN YOU KEEP THE SYRINGES IN THE FRIDGE???? Great post by the way very helpful.. Thank You
I take it your mean with hcg in them? Id say no time frame, the syringe is sterol and its in the fridge. If your using BW the HCG is good for 60days so even in a syringe Id say its fine..........11
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  #52  
Old 05-22-2008, 04:25 PM
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I read about the spike in the old anabolic reference guide 6th edition. and have seen it elsewhere.
Ive always done subq but curious to see if any difference IM. I could see how IM would enter bloodstream faster.........11
Did you ever find out if there is a difference?

Thanks.
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  #53  
Old 05-22-2008, 06:18 PM
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ok thanks
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  #54  
Old 05-23-2008, 07:44 PM
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Did you ever find out if there is a difference?

Thanks.
No still doing subq, Gh/IGF I'll do IM.............11
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  #55  
Old 06-10-2008, 01:32 PM
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Hey 11, i want to run Hcg pre-pct. Ive been running it throughout my Test E/TrenE cycle at 500mcg e5d. So just to be clear i have to run it for 14 days, starting after my last shot at the same dosage? and then start my PCT?
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  #56  
Old 06-10-2008, 02:15 PM
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Originally Posted by johnybravoe View Post
Hey 11, i want to run Hcg pre-pct. Ive been running it throughout my Test E/TrenE cycle at 500mcg e5d. So just to be clear i have to run it for 14 days, starting after my last shot at the same dosage? and then start my PCT?
Correct but after your last shot of HCG (day14) wait 4 days (day18 after test shot) to start your PCT...............11
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  #57  
Old 06-10-2008, 02:35 PM
johnybravoe johnybravoe is offline
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ok bro, thanks alot. the 500mcg e5d will be enough though? i read some threads were guys take higher doses during that time. just want to b sure.thanks
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  #58  
Old 06-11-2008, 01:45 PM
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ok bro, thanks alot. the 500mcg e5d will be enough though? i read some threads were guys take higher doses during that time. just want to b sure.thanks
I would think since your on HCG the whole cycle that should be enough. If you feel your boys aren't up to par after your last test shot then maybe try 500iu 2xwk during those 2wks and see how they respond, just don't go over 2,000iu wk IMO..............11
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  #59  
Old 06-29-2008, 04:41 PM
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If one is on TRT, is HCG ever necessary? Because i feel that i have low test and will probably get on TRT but when i took test in the past with no HCG, my sex drive would fall after 8 weeks. What are your thoughts?
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  #60  
Old 06-29-2008, 06:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Yeah Buddeh! View Post
If one is on TRT, is HCG ever necessary? Because i feel that i have low test and will probably get on TRT but when i took test in the past with no HCG, my sex drive would fall after 8 weeks. What are your thoughts?
If its Doc perscibed TRT, HCG might be a part of it,,,, not sure, never been on TRT.
If your doing a TRT dose on your own I would use small amounts from time to time as you feel needed. Since TRT is full time try to use as little as possible to get the job done, (thats always the case anyway) say 300-500ius E5D for a few months then MAYBE take a month off ?? or just stay on low dose. But if this is Doc perscibed then talk with him about it............11
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  #61  
Old 06-30-2008, 02:15 AM
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Originally Posted by Eleven11 View Post
If its Doc perscibed TRT, HCG might be a part of it,,,, not sure, never been on TRT.
If your doing a TRT dose on your own I would use small amounts from time to time as you feel needed. Since TRT is full time try to use as little as possible to get the job done, (thats always the case anyway) say 300-500ius E5D for a few months then MAYBE take a month off ?? or just stay on low dose. But if this is Doc perscibed then talk with him about it............11
If your on TRT and taking T-C or E injections weekly then inject sub-Q 250iu 2 days before and 250iu the day before your TRT shot. Assuming your on T-C for TRT, eventhough the halflife is 8 days you will usually feel a drop off on day 5. So take 250iu on day 5 and 6, then take your TRT shot on day 7. If you are injecting your TRT med multiple times a week it gets a little tricky to dose the HCG. If your only taking your prescribed TRT dosage injecting every 7 days is fine. The dosage will be small enough that you shouldn't have any sides and if you have HCG it will help keep your blood levels more stable by boosting LH. If you are primary hypo. then disregard everything I said because HCG will only keep your boys full.
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  #62  
Old 07-03-2008, 03:15 PM
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Great read!

I do have one question though. Can HCG be injected along with AAS?

Thanks
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  #63  
Old 07-03-2008, 11:53 PM
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Originally Posted by rsn032 View Post
Great read!

I do have one question though. Can HCG be injected along with AAS?

Thanks
If you load up the juice syringe, pull back out the plunger then spray in the correct amount of IU's of HCG. Then put the juice plunger back in, shake, get rid of the bubbles, and then go for it.
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  #64  
Old 07-05-2008, 05:52 PM
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^^^ ya I guess it can be done but it just seem to me it would be much easier to just do it seperate. I would think to get the proper measurment of HCG you'd need a slinpin so you may as well inject with it IMO. I just don't see an advantage to trying to mix them in the same shot.................11
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  #65  
Old 07-20-2008, 10:52 PM
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Good, informative thread.

The last cycle I did was my first with HCG, I ran it in low doses throughout. I can honestly say I'll never do a cycle again without the stuff. It made the recovery a breeze.
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  #66  
Old 07-21-2008, 12:38 AM
Onslaught81 Onslaught81 is offline
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Originally Posted by Eleven11 View Post
^^^ ya I guess it can be done but it just seem to me it would be much easier to just do it seperate. I would think to get the proper measurment of HCG you'd need a slinpin so you may as well inject with it IMO. I just don't see an advantage to trying to mix them in the same shot.................11
Neither do I. I don't do it but have in the past when I had no unused insulin syringes.
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  #67  
Old 08-02-2008, 09:47 PM
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okay so if one is on Sust 250 and running HCG 250 twice a week threw out the cycle, how long after last injection of sust should HCG be ran for before PCT?
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  #68  
Old 08-03-2008, 07:33 AM
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Very cool post,right now im cruising on test-enthanate(300mgs. every 4th day)and HCG 500iu's every 3rd day with VERY GOOD RESULTS!!(i also use 0.5mg. of arimidex every 3rd. day).
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  #69  
Old 08-03-2008, 08:25 AM
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HCG suppresses the HPTA, and should therefore not be used during conventional PCT.

anti-estrogens stimulate the HPTA via negative feedback (no E, no T, the hypothalamus starts the mill much faster than it would otherwise) so they are the only true recovery agents.

if you dont intend to recover fully back to a clean state (like some TRT and quasi-TRT guys do), then it's fine to keep using HCG thru to the next cycle, so long as you understand that your hypothalamus wont recover (this is good for those of us with shitty natty T levels)
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  #70  
Old 08-03-2008, 10:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Ice-T View Post
okay so if one is on Sust 250 and running HCG 250 twice a week threw out the cycle, how long after last injection of sust should HCG be ran for before PCT?
with sust and test cyp its 18days. I would do my last shot of HCG on the 18th day. Then wait 3days and start PCT on the 4th, reason is you'll get a 2nd serge from the HCG about 48-72hrs after shot...............11
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  #71  
Old 08-07-2008, 02:09 AM
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11 have u ever done 5000 ius in a week? if so can u tell a difference between 500 ius and 5000 ius a week. some suggest it works best that way cause they come in 5000iu amps so one or two shots would be ideal. i guess to each his own.
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  #72  
Old 08-07-2008, 07:37 PM
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11 have u ever done 5000 ius in a week? if so can u tell a difference between 500 ius and 5000 ius a week. some suggest it works best that way cause they come in 5000iu amps so one or two shots would be ideal. i guess to each his own.
No Ive never done more than 2,000ius per wk. in the past Id do 1,000 2xwk a wk before cycle ended and 2wks after then start PCT. 1,000ius has always been plenty to jump start the boys even after a cycle when not using during.
Now I use small amounts during so never more than 500ius.

I guess what your friends are saying is at the end of cycle that didn't include HCG use larger amount to get boys back and that may be fine ?? I would think that larger amounts would be ok if its just for a wk or 2 but my belief has always been to use the least amount possible.............11
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  #73  
Old 08-08-2008, 04:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eleven11 View Post
Everything Im writing here is based on my personal opinion from info Ive read and from personal trial and error.
Ive done many cycles that did not include HCG in my early days, hell I didn't even know what PCT was. This was WAY before the internet so all my info was from freinds and the few books that were around.
I've done cycles that ended with just using HCG the 2wks after my last testE shot and saw results from that(1,000ius 2xwk/ 2wks). IMO never go over 2,000ius per week.
But about 3yrs ago I started using small amounts of HCG throughout the cycle with much better results. The theory behind this is to give constant stimulation throughout the cycle and not let your own test production stop, or at least minimize it. Ive also noticed my sex drive stayed constant while on HCG even when using Tren or Npp/Deca and doing very long cycles. This is without a doubt the best way to run it and IMO leads to better overall gains, reason is not only are you using artificial Test/AAS but you are still producing your own, to me this makes since.
There are 2 ways to use this method. note: always use the LEAST amount that you can get results from.

1) 250-300ius EOD starting after wk1 and continued through cycle and for 4-18days after last AAS shot depending on the ester length (prop 4.5days - testE 14days - test Cyp 18days). Always make the last HCG shot on day ester clears.

2) 500ius E5D starting after wk1 and (same as above)

Ive done both and really can't say one is better, with #2 you won't go through as many needles but both have worked well for me.

PCT ( post cycle therapy )

Key word here is POST, meaning after the cycle is over and that means after all AAS esters have cleared your system not after your final shot.
HCG IS NOT FOR PCT IT IS FOR PRE-PCT, the time during your cycle and after last shot of AAS while esters are clearing. PCT starts on DAY4 after your last HCG shot. The reason for this is when you inject HCG you will get a spike several hours after shot and then again 72 hours later, after this final spike is when you want to start your PCT. Again HCG is not used for PCT.

Other info you will need.
Always use Bac water to mix your HCG, it will last up to 60 days in the fridge when BW is used.
Always use an insulin needle for injecting, size of slinpin does not matter but I use 29g 1cc.

Now like I said this is my personal opinion on HCG.
Can you get by without HCG, sure.
Can you get by without PCT, sure
Can you build muscle without AAS, yes.
But if your going to spent your hard earned $$ on ASS, food and training then at least spend a little extra on trying to keep as much of those gains as possible and make recovery as easy as possible................11

agree, 250UI E3D for me works great
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  #74  
Old 08-27-2008, 10:52 AM
Jackhamma Jackhamma is offline
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I have been following this protocol for the past year and the results have been great.It makes PCT much easier instead of having to bring back size of the balls with various SERMs and AI.All that is required for me is 3-4 weeks of nolva only.I would like to ask 2 questions in particular.I hope 11 could chime in:
1. For those who stay on year round, would they still use low dose Hcg?
2 If so,can 250 or 500iu for a long term cause some desensitization?
Thanks.
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  #75  
Old 08-27-2008, 11:30 AM
Big Jay Big Jay is offline
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Well i missed the whole using HCG while on thing since i only have 2 weeks left of prop. Guess i'll be using it during Phase 1 of my PCT with Nolva and A-dex. Any thoughts?

Going to do 1000iu e4d
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