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  #26  
Old 12-17-2018, 11:28 AM
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Originally Posted by Destructos View Post
Dude... Its spelled "PANTHER" not "panthar". I did a search and found your pictures and you dont look like you have ever been in a gym. You are an outright weirdo. No one wanted to see that picture of you without clothes on you creep, lol.


And you have spent THOUSANDS AND THOUSANDS of $$$$ and how many airplane tickets trying to get your little balls to work again? You're so retarded you cant even fabricate a believable lie.
Outright weirdo? This is outlawmuscle! Most people on these forums are meatheads who live with their parents @ 30 and have NO career. I'm probably one of the least weird persons here. What do you do for a living Destructos?
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  #27  
Old 12-17-2018, 12:02 PM
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Originally Posted by pinkpanthar View Post
Outright weirdo? This is outlawmuscle! Most people on these forums are meatheads who live with their parents @ 30 and have NO career. I'm probably one of the least weird persons here. What do you do for a living Destructos?
I must be one of those 30 year olds that live with my parents. I mean everyone should believe what someone says who canít spell (panther). So far no one has called me a homosexual Guineapig though.
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  #28  
Old 12-17-2018, 12:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Destructos View Post
If it is 100% correct, you should have no problem, citing your work.

The first google search I came up with Leydig cell desensitization by human chorionic gonadotropin does not occur in the human fetal testis.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/4008604

Then there is this: http://www.totrevolution.com/hcg-hum...ing-need-know/ Maybe not that reputable but I bet they can spell "Panther" hCG has been clinically proven to restore fertility in men undergoing TRT.


I'm going to dig around a bit more.
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Originally Posted by MorganKane View Post
There are several doctors with plenty of research in this field that totally disagree with you.

How long have you been a doctor?
How much personal research have you done?
How many people have you personally treated and what has the success rate been?
Hey all- frankly, itís been a while since Iíve looked into this, so Iíll go back and look for research on Leydig cell desensitization.

Iím not ďarguing,Ē and am happy to look at more data. Iíll read a bit and post more later on in the week.

Just my 2 cents,
- hungry
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  #29  
Old 12-17-2018, 12:45 PM
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Originally Posted by HungryEctomorph View Post
Hey all- frankly, itís been a while since Iíve looked into this, so Iíll go back and look for research on Leydig cell desensitization.

Iím not ďarguing,Ē and am happy to look at more data. Iíll read a bit and post more later on in the week.

Just my 2 cents,
- hungry
John Crisler never goes above 300ius per day, in fear of desensitizing the leydig cells.

He's the foremost expert on TRT in the world.
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  #30  
Old 12-17-2018, 01:08 PM
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Originally Posted by pinkpanthar View Post
Your picture is a white trash cocksucker, on his way to a klu klux clan rally.

I have more authority on this issue than ANY person in the HISTORY of Outlawmuscle. So how about you post pics or shut up? Srsly go fuck yourself. The endocrine system is extremely complex and getting it back online requires patience, not the heavy handed retardation of the majority of ppl on OLM.

"If I were you, I would BLAST HCG bro. Maybe like 10,000 ius per day for a month."

That won't work.

PS I've met with ALL the leading doctors in the industry you inbred white trash trump voting neanderthal. Michael Schally. John Crisler. Mayo Clinic. Suck my dick, hard.

PPS "If I were you I would hit the triptorellin. The HMG. And you're gonna neeed to BLAST really high dosages. That's what Iwould do!" Fucking retard, please kill yourself.

PPPS No srsly kill yourself, advice from people like you is downright dangerous. Please kill yourself. You're a parasite.

PPPPS No srsly, pull a Pete Davidson and REALLY kill yourself It's retards like you that get people HURT.
LOL.. you have more authority on this than anyone in the history of OLM but think a picture will determine that. You are retarded.
Not even worth the time to argue with idiots like you.

I am actually a patient of one of the most knowledgeable TRT docs. Seeing him on Wednesday again. I will ask him why he dont know his shit based on your observations. I am sure he will join OLM and beg you for your knowledge. Will also send Dr. Scally an email and ask him to do the same. I am sure they love to hear you broknowledge on the subject.
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  #31  
Old 12-17-2018, 02:04 PM
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Jesus christ yall calm the fuck down.
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  #32  
Old 12-17-2018, 02:20 PM
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Originally Posted by pinkpanthar View Post
John Crisler never goes above 300ius per day, in fear of desensitizing the leydig cells.

He's the foremost expert on TRT in the world.
You might want to check on that number, its not what he says.
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  #33  
Old 12-17-2018, 05:35 PM
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He recommends 250-500mg hcg per dose. If you do twice a week injections for trt injections then do hcg day before each injection.

Panthar was right about the desenitization of hcg. It also does supress Luteinizing hormone in doses more than 500mg causing primary hypogonadal suppression.

https://drjohncrisler.com/the-crisle...part-deux.html

Last edited by DtownButch : 12-17-2018 at 05:39 PM.
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  #34  
Old 12-17-2018, 07:34 PM
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Just keep digging a hole dude. While you think everyone on OLM is a dumbass, including medical professionals; people are seeing you as a fool. Now you are back peddling. You said it couldn't be done, to throw in the towel and now you are posting that it can?
http://www.outlawmuscle.com/forum/sh...6&postcount=10
http://www.outlawmuscle.com/forum/sh...0&postcount=12

Last edited by Destructos : 12-25-2018 at 05:30 PM.
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  #35  
Old 12-17-2018, 07:36 PM
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Originally Posted by MorganKane View Post
LOL.. you have more authority on this than anyone in the history of OLM but think a picture will determine that. You are retarded.
Not even worth the time to argue with idiots like you.

I am actually a patient of one of the most knowledgeable TRT docs. Seeing him on Wednesday again. I will ask him why he dont know his shit based on your observations. I am sure he will join OLM and beg you for your knowledge. Will also send Dr. Scally an email and ask him to do the same. I am sure they love to hear you broknowledge on the subject.
Dont forget to ask him how you spell (PANTHAR)

https://www.google.com/search?client...undergoing+TRT.

Last edited by Destructos : 12-17-2018 at 07:44 PM.
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  #36  
Old 12-17-2018, 07:59 PM
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Originally Posted by DtownButch View Post
He recommends 250-500mg hcg per dose. If you do twice a week injections for trt injections then do hcg day before each injection.

Panthar was right about the desenitization of hcg. It also does supress Luteinizing hormone in doses more than 500mg causing primary hypogonadal suppression.

https://drjohncrisler.com/the-crisle...part-deux.html
I think panthar claimed you shouldn't use HCG period. He said it was worthless, throw in the towel, it wont work, so pantar was NOT right. what you posted and I posted both stated the use of HCG. Scroll back and read his comments. He has spent THOUSANDS AND THOUSANDS of dollars and so many airplane tickets and it simply can not be done. So are you agreeing with him that it cant happen? You cant just pick out one thing and say everything he typed is correct because it isnt.

Using human chorionic gonadotropin (hCG) every so often (daily, weekly to perhaps even every other week) at a dosage of 250 to 500 iu’s per injection (injecting subcutaneously into the fat tissue of lower stomach or the fat pad of outer glute with an insulin syringe) will provide your testicles an increase in size or fullness. hCG has been clinically proven to restore fertility in men undergoing TRT.

http://www.totrevolution.com/hcg-hum...ing-need-know/

Last edited by Destructos : 12-17-2018 at 08:02 PM.
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  #37  
Old 12-17-2018, 10:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Destructos View Post
I think panthar claimed you shouldn't use HCG period. He said it was worthless, throw in the towel, it wont work, so pantar was NOT right. what you posted and I posted both stated the use of HCG. Scroll back and read his comments. He has spent THOUSANDS AND THOUSANDS of dollars and so many airplane tickets and it simply can not be done. So are you agreeing with him that it cant happen? You cant just pick out one thing and say everything he typed is correct because it isnt.

Using human chorionic gonadotropin (hCG) every so often (daily, weekly to perhaps even every other week) at a dosage of 250 to 500 iu’s per injection (injecting subcutaneously into the fat tissue of lower stomach or the fat pad of outer glute with an insulin syringe) will provide your testicles an increase in size or fullness. hCG has been clinically proven to restore fertility in men undergoing TRT.

http://www.totrevolution.com/hcg-hum...ing-need-know/
I don't agree with him on the recovery part. It can be done. Matter of fact these docs have achieved it. Only part i agree with him on is hcg in high doses above 500iu can desensitize leydig cell and Lh. In terms of recovery some can recover and some can't. To say it can't be done is foolish! The younger you are and the less you abused aas the higher the probability of recovery, but as you approach 40 it's a moot point. I think his explanation was too broad to say that all cant recover.

Last edited by DtownButch : 12-17-2018 at 10:23 PM.
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  #38  
Old 12-18-2018, 06:41 AM
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Thank you... he stated that it couldnít be done is the problem I had. And that HCG wouldnít help. I agree with you.
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  #39  
Old 12-18-2018, 06:50 AM
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Thanks for the info! Good read this morning.

Recently took a ride w a buddy to his doc for this.
Been on 200 mg cyp for a year and he felt burned out.

Protocol PCT for him was:
500iu hcg 25 days and 50mg clomid same day.
Take 5 days off.
Go back to hcg and clomid same dose 25 days.
5 days off, then repeat 3rd time.

He is finishing 3rd phase and still sex drive down, but feels good while in gym. Did lose 10lbs. Testicles increase slightly. Wasnt interested in fertility.
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  #40  
Old 12-18-2018, 08:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mag1 View Post
Thanks for the info! Good read this morning.

Recently took a ride w a buddy to his doc for this.
Been on 200 mg cyp for a year and he felt burned out.

Protocol PCT for him was:
500iu hcg 25 days and 50mg clomid same day.
Take 5 days off.
Go back to hcg and clomid same dose 25 days.
5 days off, then repeat 3rd time.

He is finishing 3rd phase and still sex drive down, but feels good while in gym. Did lose 10lbs. Testicles increase slightly. Wasnt interested in fertility.
PCT protocol vs TRT is different.
Someone here dont seem to understand that (not you).

Recovery can take a long time. Long as in months and months.
I think most people start PCT way too early and stay on it way too short.
Thank you for sharing.
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  #41  
Old 12-18-2018, 11:29 AM
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^^^yes!
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  #42  
Old 12-21-2018, 12:25 PM
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Originally Posted by MorganKane View Post
LOL.. you have more authority on this than anyone in the history of OLM but think a picture will determine that. You are retarded.
Not even worth the time to argue with idiots like you.

I am actually a patient of one of the most knowledgeable TRT docs. Seeing him on Wednesday again. I will ask him why he dont know his shit based on your observations. I am sure he will join OLM and beg you for your knowledge. Will also send Dr. Scally an email and ask him to do the same. I am sure they love to hear you broknowledge on the subject.
I dare you, faggot.

And yes, I have infinitely more knowledge on this subject, and experience, than the combination of everyone on this website. You can take my word for it. Look at ALLLL my past threads on it. Or simply shut the fuck up.
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  #43  
Old 12-21-2018, 12:54 PM
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Stop with the name calling unless you want a vacation from the board.



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I dare you, faggot.

And yes, I have infinitely more knowledge on this subject, and experience, than the combination of everyone on this website. You can take my word for it. Look at ALLLL my past threads on it. Or simply shut the fuck up.
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  #44  
Old 12-22-2018, 05:56 PM
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Originally Posted by pinkpanthar View Post
I dare you, faggot.

And yes, I have infinitely more knowledge on this subject, and experience, than the combination of everyone on this website. You can take my word for it. Look at ALLLL my past threads on it. Or simply shut the fuck up.
Oh boy, here you go again.

You are simply not worth anyone's time here.
Your claims are nothing but your claims.

Its like "I spoke to someone" there for I am an expert.
I met someone there for I am an expert.
anyone here can google Crisler and see what he wrote.
Well, everyone but you since you didnt even get that right.
Do you even understand the difference between TRT and PCT?


Seriously, you are funny with your claims but not worth much time.

Oh, yes, I have looked at your threads over the years, thats why I think you just run your mouth with whatever you googled.
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  #45  
Old 12-22-2018, 06:23 PM
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Originally Posted by pinkpanthar View Post
I dare you, faggot.

And yes, I have infinitely more knowledge on this subject, and experience, than the combination of everyone on this website. You can take my word for it. Look at ALLLL my past threads on it. Or simply shut the fuck up.
You cant possibly know the experience or level of competence of people you don't know. The OP is not as fluent in English as the rest of us and there were 2 different things he was concerned with.
1) being sterile
2) testes not making testosterone

The first question I would wonder is what he calls abuse. I ran several cycles and knocked a woman up the first night I had sex with her. The OP didn't mention a sperm count. Maybe you just know what it is since you know everything else?

The second question was regarding testosterone level. After "using or abusing" steroids; I had no problem regaining testosterone levels after coming off of a cycle. It was only as I got older that my levels had waned; just like every other man my age.

You PANTHAR were wrong on both questions. I have personally had success with sperm count and testosterone levels returning after using steroids. As MK stated there is a difference in PCT and TRT.

(I spent 5 years, thousands and thousands of dollars, and many plane tickets trying to figure out a restart...) For what? Sperm count or testosterone Levels?
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  #46  
Old 12-22-2018, 06:25 PM
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Hey guys hcg only desensitizes in really really heavy fuckin doses u only need 250 to 500iu every 3rd or 4th day i run long cycles for months on end using 250iu every 3rd day trt docs use this protocol for years on end with little to no issue but they do not go past 500iu ever this a fact theres no need to go higher its also better to stay on for a long time using hcg recovery wise now pct can take months on end but as far as me the hcg untill the last 1 or 2 of the cycle then i recover farly well 30 to 90 days after with decent test numbers i also only use small doses of clomid and nolvedex but the hcg helps also its like the boys are ready to go and there other things as hell to signal the putitary but i have never seem to need that as of yet just dont ever go over 500iu its that simple and u will not desensitive small doses of hcg are better theres much less risk and its works
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  #47  
Old 12-29-2018, 01:28 AM
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I don't think someone who has crashed their nuts, for lack of better phrase, due to abuse and improper pct, should reasonably worry about instant "desensitization" of going past a low dose of hcg.

I'm not a fuckin doctor and honestly don't know any research based science on this, but i would imagine it is something of a universal law that it requires more juice/lifeforce to bring something that's dead or near death to life than to over stinulate.

We all also have different individualized physiologies and age is prob a factor as well, so I don't think I need any kind of documented expertise to say that only individualized blood tests would to customize a protocol would be what makes the most sense.
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  #48  
Old 12-29-2018, 03:00 PM
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Stop with the name calling unless you want a vacation from the board.



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  #49  
Old 12-30-2018, 06:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Destructos View Post
You cant possibly know the experience or level of competence of people you don't know. The OP is not as fluent in English as the rest of us and there were 2 different things he was concerned with.
1) being sterile
2) testes not making testosterone

The first question I would wonder is what he calls abuse. I ran several cycles and knocked a woman up the first night I had sex with her. The OP didn't mention a sperm count. Maybe you just know what it is since you know everything else?

The second question was regarding testosterone level. After "using or abusing" steroids; I had no problem regaining testosterone levels after coming off of a cycle. It was only as I got older that my levels had waned; just like every other man my age.

You PANTHAR were wrong on both questions. I have personally had success with sperm count and testosterone levels returning after using steroids. As MK stated there is a difference in PCT and TRT.

(I spent 5 years, thousands and thousands of dollars, and many plane tickets trying to figure out a restart...) For what? Sperm count or testosterone Levels?
Aren't you transgender?

I'm not sure your unique situation can be universalized to the general population; I'm glad you have accepted yourself though.

#Brave
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  #50  
Old 12-30-2018, 07:20 PM
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Years ago I did a very very long cycle it took me almost a year to recover it just took time and patience
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